France Warns Macedonia over 'Name Row'

Nikola............ it will be most prudent to inform your people that the charade is slowly coming to an end, you can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time..........the french people know what is greek and what is not,,.........they are expert scholars on hellenistic culture....stop the circus Nikola and join the European Union of Nations....... Kostas

THE UNITED NATIONS,NATO, THE EU, ETC., KEEP REPEATING THE SAME MESSAGE TO MR. GRUEVSKI'S GOVERNMENT: CHANGE YOUR NAME AND STOP STEALING THE HISTORY AND CULTURE OF GREECE AND BULGARIA! BUT IT SEEMS THE GENERAL NATIONALISTIC HYSTERIA IN THE COUNTRY HAS MADE EVERYBODY DEAF... BALKAN TROUBLE MAKERS BE AWARE-YOUR NEIGHBOURS CANNOT BE PATIENT FOR EVER!

French............ who cares what they think, if you do your a mullaka. Greek or Macedonian hahaha

This is a waste of time. It is obvious that this country wants to live in the last century and is not willing to adopt a common sense(easy, as said) solution consisting of a simple qualifier which will aknowledge that not all Macedonians belong to this country. Since accepting reality is too hard, there is no point for either the EU or anyone else to waste time and money on integration or any other issues.

The Republic of Macedonia will never succumb to 'greek' pressure and lies. Those so called 'greeks' insistant on changing Macedonia's are in fact from Asia Minor - No corrupt Frenchman or EU official will ever hide that truth. Australians tried to erradicate Aborigines many years ago today they apologise, Germans tried to erradicate Jews and far from succeded etc etc. The EU Justice, i.e Kangaroo Court will never succeed. The truth ALWAYS wins. EU careful who you support the tables can turn - history has proven that time and time again.

Sort your own house, before you make any threats. With your own people turning against your left wing govt, it sounds like your focus should be on your own countrymen and women rather than anybody else's. I wonder if the French, would support Greece, if they had not sold 350 million + warfare?

Since the french minister is in agreement with greece to change the name of Macedonia, I suggest that we pick a different name. Let's call it FRANCE.

...and where are your "Macedonians" from? Or are you going to tell us they've been there since Philip and Alexander?

Greece has stollen 51% of Macedonia and 40% of Macedonian nation since 1913. EU has to pressure Greece to restore these injustices. After all 2013 is very close.

"I wonder if the French, would support Greece, if they had not sold 350 million + warfare?" -------------------------------------- I wonder also, if US would support FYRON if they had not agreed on building there their biggest military base in Europe and if they had not agreed in recruiting men from FYROM for every war they start in the world? Weird life eh? lol lol

I wonder....I wonder....hey...stop wondering. Well, I wonder if FYROM would be taking such a hard stand if they were not supported by the US? I just wonder? The only reason for this support is for the military base that the US wants to build....mmm...I just wonder.

Hey Mathew..... where are you from? Turkey?? LOL!!!!! One day soon Macedonia will be recognized. The only thing that the greeks will be recognized for is bending over to the turks!!! LOL!!!!!

you are confused ringo ...I hope thats not a trend of your people........its a right wing government ringo not left....

you make it up as you go a long dont you risto?.....where do you get your historical facts from? ....if the sources are reliable why dont you contact one of those famous french universities and help them to rewrite their history books......

The name dispute is a bilateral issues with Greece,not EU requirement.When the Republic of Macedonia went to Bucharest,Macedonia went with the "FYROM" why than Greece did Veto Macedonias entry to NATO?The 1995 interim agreement stipulates that Greece will not object to Macedonias entry into international organizations.To me at least it looks like NATO and EU are a bunch of idiots together with Greece.Mr.Sarkozis gandparents were born in Macedonia,Salonika of jewish ethnicity.The Greek government allowed the ultra right wing to attack the Jewish minority in Athens,also the courts warned the Jewish complainants of the abuse againts them by the Nazi skin heads to go home and be quite or may become worse for them.Bravo Mr. Sarkozi for supporting the Neonazis in Greece. When the Macedonians in Northern Greece (Macedonia) protested againts the War games in their bachyards,the Greek government ignored the peoples plea and arrested dozens of the protesters,they even escorted the Macedonian media to the border.Now in Athens one youth was killed,the Greek government pays more attention.Why is it they do protect the Greeks nut not the Macedonian minority?Where are the members of the NATO and EU to put a stop to the harrasment of the Macedonian minority by the Greek government?NATO and EU will be irrelevant in the bear future because they are buying out each other.Look at Greece offering 100 old tanks to DRO Congo,the 200 milion dollars offered to Corazon Aquino who did tell Greece that Macedonia is in the Bible.She refused their offer.Greece is buying off the members of EU and NATO with NATO and EU money,ha ha!It is very funy dont you think?Keep it on,both organizations will wake-up some day and Greece will be told enouph is enouph!

I am so happy to point the inability of the EU in whole to resolve any isses, the Macedonia name issue is a good example (one of many). USA remains the leader in the world on so many fields despite everything. Look at Athens and it's currents position and the riots and look at Skopje and it's inability to stand as a nation. EU will allways e in the shadow of the UNITED STATES (get it UnITED) of AMERICA

It shouldn't come as a surprise that a French foreign minister would come out and say this. Whether or not you think they are taking sides in the name dispute, the French have never been big fans of EU enlargement.

I simply cannot understand why nations aspiring to be EU member states and wishing to be integrated with the rest of Europe try to dictate their retarded agendas to the EU. The EU has no real need of you (i.e. Turkey & FYROM) so stop being so naive and listen to those who have suffered in their past and fought hard to be what they are today.. true democracies, not fake states ruled by dictators and using democracy as a puppet.

Risto, what does "2013 is very close" mean? The Treaty of Bucharest again? Jesus, get over it already. The ECSC treaty that gave birth to what is now the EU expired in 2002, but the EU is still around. If you think that Greek sovereignty over Macedonia will somehow be in doubt, wouldn't that also apply to Skopje, which inherited its sovereignty from Serbia > Yugoslavia? Or will the treaty expire only for the Greeks? As for calling on the EU to support your historically dubious irredentism, keep dreaming.

Guys, are you not joining the protests today? Do you think Karamanlis' Gov will fall? It is hurendous there, I hope none of you is hurt! I admire how Greek people stand up against the lack of rule of law and against non-democratic police force in their country.ALthough for the record, I do not condone the violence and the looting.

Supose all of the comments (the ones with common sence, of course) have some part of the truth... even, nobody have mentioned the basic right of each country, to call itself the way it wants (even "repeting of exisitng name" has passed in the history or two countries sharing same name...etc, etc...), as long as that name does not means any aggression to any other country (and not just neighbors countries...). At the end, all this are only "internal political points" for the goverments, don't think that the Macedonians wants to still anything of the great Greek history, neither the Greeks wants to have problems with the neighbor country (supose they prefere to solve thier internal problems before), neither Macedonia will attack Greece, etc, etc... Even if EU or Greece, or any other world organization, country, or even the Macedonian Goverment changes the actual name of Republic of Macedonia, the Macedonians will still call themselfs equally... Macedonians ... and they will continue call their country Macedonia... Hope some much clever people will come up to the scene and will solve this issue soon... A.

I am french and I disagree with my government. They don't believe themselves to what they tell. Every politicians say "macedonia" speaking about this country, so it means that they don't give a damn about this problem,...but what problem actually ?

"CHANGE YOUR NAME AND STOP STELING GREEK HISTORY" also "YOUR NEIGHBOURS CANNOT BE PATIENT FOREVER" SORRY BUT I AM AFFRAID YOU ARE WRONG!! POINT-1 JUST READ SOME "INDEPENDENT" LITERATURE RELATING TO MACEDONIA AND ITS HISTORY YOU WILL SEE THAT IT WAS GREECE THAT "AQUIRED" 51% OF MACEDONIAN LAND AND NOW IS USING EVERY MEANS, MOST OF WHICH IS ILLIGAL, TO FORCE MACEDONIA TO CHANGE ITS NAME. POINT-2 SARKOZY THE GREEK PRESIDENT, SORRY, FRENCH PRESIDENT INSTRUCTS HIS FM TO SAY SOMETHING THAT GOES BEYOND ABSURDITY. THE EU WILL FALL ON ITS OWN SWORD AND DESTROY ALL ITS CREDIBILITY AND STANDARDS IN THE PROCESS IF IT IS PRESSURED BY GREECE TO FORCE MACEDONIA INTO A "CHANGE YOUR NAME" OR NO EU MEMBERSHIP.

Macedonia must grand its land to Russia for a big military base.Has to threat the clowns of EU that it will not be forever with west's side.And then we will see if they will continue to say those bullshits...

another imposter using my penname, ringo? Didn't you guys notice the incorrect remark over a "left-wing government"? I don't usually make such mistakes, pity no one wondered out loud...

Okay go ahead and build a Russian base. Who cares anyway. But you will still be out of NATO and EU and we will be laughing at you, that is if you survive as a fake country.

I think that there is a bigger picture here, If they do divide Kosovo & give Serbia part of it, the Albanians may want a part of Macedonia to compensate their loss? If Macedonia is not part of Nato & EU then it is only Macedonia's Problem. After this conflict & due to Macedonia being unstable they may even try to split Macedonia up between the countries that received land in 1913, there should already be Nato & EU troops there supposedly to help with the conflict. This could explain why Greece has a part of Republic of Macedonia "Bitola & Strumica" on their new Greek Map that they have hanging in their offices & Embassies.

Read Mr John Shae's expose of Greece's stupid claim on Macedonia's history. Also go to Igenea.com and find for yourself that 30% of Macedonians in Republic of Macedonia have direct DNA links to ancient macedonians. The number in Greece is 5%, but gets a little larger when one gets closer north. There is no DNA connection between present day Greeks and ancient Macedonians, but there is such a link with Macedonians. As for ownership of history, present day Greeks have no claim on what happened 2,500 years ago in what were esentially city states, which never extended North beyond the 40th parallel. Macedonians were never Greeks. On 21 and 23 November 1926, the Greek government published an directive in Efimerists Kiverniseos NO 322 & 324 for all Macedonians to change their surnames to "os", "es" and "poulos". Why would it want to do that if its claim on history was sound? After Macedonia's partition to Greece was conpleted, the Greek King George 1 on 31 October 1912 proclaimed the Decree of Occupation. Note the words: Decree of Occupation. IOt was not a decree of liberation!!

Read the short, simple proof in these forums: If ancient Macedonians were nongreek, how come jews who fought Alexander's successors celebrate their victory over greeks and not macedonians in Channukah? I guess greeks must have bribed them to say so!

For all the Greek posters As per William Gladsone! "MACEDONIA FOR THE MACEDONIANS" I bet not a single greek on this forum can prove he is directly related to the Ancient Greeks, if anything you probably have more Turk and Bulgar in you. So please, convince and i'll call myself Bulgarian if you can manage that.. Oh and for those claiming location as your argument... I live in Australia and speak English, does that mean I am anglo saxon..? So quick to judge others yet you can't prove any relation to the Ancient Greeks.. how do u know you are more albanian/turk/slavic than ancient greek? go on prove it.. :)

What are you smoking and what does it have to do with Ancient macedonia? Let's get some facts: 334 BC - Satrap menon (a greek) led Greeks against Alexander 1st Battle at Granicus - Alexander took 15,000 Greek prisoners. 333 BC - 2nd battle at Issus Greeks took part and were anhiliated. But the big question you seem to be avoiding is why did the King of Greece announced a Decree of occupation and not one of liberation? Why did the Greek government force all Macedonians to change their surnames? 331 BC - Biggest battle at Guagamela Greeks were members of the War council of Darius. He lostas did the Greeks who helped.

megali idea is a proto-slav example of what a tito/communist edjumakation does to a young mind. Hey, yugo man, can we get a link to your DNA results (I'd love to find out where he got 'samples' of the ancient Macedonians?)

What a novel concept, Macedonia for the Macedonians. I was born and raised in Aegean Macedonia which during my childhood the Greek occupiers had renamed 'Voria Elada, northern Greece. If in fact Macedonia was Greek why than did Greece after their occupation of Macedonia find it necessary to change the name of the region to Northern Greece? The answer is simple, Greece flooded Macedonia with hundreds of thousands of Asia Minor refugees and since they were not Macedonian they could no longer call the area Macedonia. The Greek posters in this board don't seem to even know the basic recent history that Greece changed the Northern Greece region name to Macedonia in 1988 when it was obvious that an independent Macedonia was in the horizon. In fact every reference to Macedonia in Greece has only happened in the last 20 years, i don't recall the Salonika airport being called the 'Makedonia' airport when i was growing up. The funniest part is when Greeks argue that they are the real descendants to Alexander the great. They forget the people in that area that now call themselves Macedonian' came that area in 1922 from Asia Minor so they ABSOLUTELY' have no connection to Alexanders Macedonians. Anybody that has lived or even traveled thru Aegian Macedonia knows that there is two very different people that live in that area today. The Dopie (locals) and the (prosfigee) the refugees from Asia Minor. The locals are the real Macedonians (and the majority support a united Macedonia) the refugees don't belong to that area (and loughingly they call themselves Macedonians). The truth is simple, and anybody that has lived in the area knows it full well(even though a lot of them don't want to admit it).

john, I don't know where you get this idiotic idea that Macedonia used to be called Northern Greece. School and every other map from the 60s call the region Macedonia. Did you live in Greece at the time and know this first hand? Also, you mention that "the locals are the real Macedonians"(one of whom is the prime minister btw) and that the majority support a unified Macedonia. Really? Did you do a poll? Because these people are btw the ones that most vividly remember the attrocities by the bulgarian comitadji at the beginning of the century as well as the actions of your Ohrana during WWII and are most outraged at your attempt to steal their identity. Plus, get this in your head: In modern societies there is movement; many people from Crete for instance now live in Macedonia. many original Macedonians have moved to Athens. As for the airport, yes, but that was only after your side claimed to be "MAcedonia". As for Metaxas, Athenians and Spartans have fought a long and bloody war and sought Persian aid, but that does not mean either of them were nongreek. Those greeks who fought with the Persians were simply dogs of war, mercenaries and would have fought with them even against Sparta or Athens. For a mercenary war is just a job! If you bothered to look in these forums you would have found an exremely simple proof for the greekness of ancient Macedonians, namely that jews who fought Alexander's successors celebrate in Channukah their victory over the greeks, NOT macedonians.

For all Greek people, you need to understqnd one simple fact - that the history you were thought at school was biased, and based on the events post 1912. For the ones who wants to get out of the dark, and learn unbiased facts - you dont have to go too far. Read Aristhotelis, who was Alexanders personal tutor. In his chronicles he wrote: Although he (Alexander) was fluent in Greek, his native language was Macedonian... ...and the Greek generals were upset when he was addressing the phalang in Macedonian - for they did not understand a word... Anyway, it is time to stop living in the past, and focus on present times - looking into the future. It is the 21st century, and such imposed issues are not needed. Every people has the right of self proclamation. History was always written by the winners, but the trouth is out there, for the ones that want to find it...

“The Academy was built with bequest from Simon Sinas, the hugely wealthy son of Georgios Sinas, a Hellenized Vlach whose family came from Moschopolis in Southern Albania, who made his fortune in the Habsburg Empire and was himself the donor of Theophilos Hansen's observatory (1843-6)”. Page 79, "A concise history Of Greece", Richard Clogg --------------------- "The ethnic mix of the Greek-speakers of the Ottoman Empire (“Greek” was often learned as a second language by wealthier non-“Greek” people) was as diverse as any in the Ottoman Empire, possibly more. The islands and the seafarers from the coastal regions were distinguished by their peculiar ethnicity, many were of mixed Albanian-Greek origin” The Balkans, Nationalism, War and the Great Powers - by Misha Glenny Page 23 ------------------------ “It is a striking fact that the leading defenders of Greek liberty at this time were largely Non-Greek. Koundouriotis was decended from the Albanian invadors of Greece in the 14th century,and spoke Greek only with difficulty. His principal colleague was John Kolettis, a Vlach who had been Ali Pasha's court doctor at Ioannina. One of the few leaders who maintained resistance far to the north of the Gulf of Corinth was the Souliote,Marko Botsaris,whos followers were largely Albanian. By a strange chance, it happend that two of the Turkish commanders-in-chief during the war, Khurshid Pasha and Muhammad Rehid Pasha(known to the Greeks as Kiutahi), were by birth Orthodox Christians, who had been converted to Islam for the sake of career in the Sultans service.” “Modern Greece A Short History” C.M. Woodhouse Page 139 ------------------------ “Greece included considerably fewer than half of those who regarded themselves as Greeks by virtue of their language,their religion, and (less plausibly) their race. It was easy to stir up agitation in favour of enlarging Greece's frontiers by a progressive extension of "enosis" (union)." Modern Greece A Short History C.M. Woodhouse Page 163 ---------------------------------- "The Koundouriotes, for example, the most powerful maritime family on the island of Hydra, who led a substantial faction during the war (of independence), were of Albanian origin'. Page 25 "The Balkans, Nationalism, War and the Great Powers" by Misha Glenny ------------------------------------------ "The obsession with Greek racial identity involves the distortion of the history of the thousands of years when there was no such thing as a Greek nation state. The early Slav invasions which reached far into the Peloponnesus and left Slav-speaking settlements well into the fifteenth century are conveniently ignored. So too is the fact that in the early nineteenth century the population of Athens was 24 per cent Albanian, 32 per cent Turkish and only 44 per cent Greek. The village of Marathon, scene of the great victory in 490 B.C., was, early in the 19-th century, almost entirely Albanian " Simon Mcilwaine - The Strange Case of the Invisible Minorities, Institutional Racism in the Greek State, International Society for Human Rights, British Section, Dec 1993. "Although modern day Greek nationalists like to boast about how they never forgot their rich heritage and cultural icons, this next piece contradicts their theories. The 'Klephts' were the Greek equivalent of the Komiti or Hajduci, the warriors who championed the notion of a free nation. 'The 18th century Greek scholar, Koumas, tells of a visit to one of the most influential Klephts, Nikotsaras (possibly of part Slavic descent, Niko-'tsar'-as). In order to show respect, Koumas addressed the Klepht leader as Achilles. Nikotsaras retorted angrily: 'What rubbish are you talking about? Who is this Achilles? Handy with a musket was he?" Page 31 "The Balkans, Nationalism, War and the Great Powers" by Misha Glenny ------------------------------------ "As it is clearly obvious the Greek nation had many divisions and diversities within that had to be addressed before they could start telling the world that they are the descendents of the ancient Hellenes. Unfortunate though it may be, the modern-day Greek has more in common genetically with the Albanians, the Latin speaking Vlachs and the Turks than with 'Plutarch's men'". "The Balkans, Nationalism, War and the Great Powers" by Misha Glenny ---------------------------- “Modern Greek identity is based on an unshakable conviction that the Greek State is ethnically homogenous. This belief has entailed repeated and official denial of the existence of minorities which are not of 'pure' Hellenic origin. The obsession with Greek racial identity involves the distortion of the history of the thousands of years when there was no such thing as a Greek nation state." Simon Mcllwaine, The Strange Case of the Invisible Minorities, Institutional Racism in the Greek State, International Society for Human Rights, British Section, Dec 1993 --------------------------------- “Consequently the medieval and modern Greeks are not the descendants of the Greeks of Antiquity, and their Hellenism is artificial". Robert Browning , Greece Old and New , edited by Tom Winnifrith and Penelope Murray, the Macmillan Press , London 1963.

Do you want to make this a list of which idiot thinks what? Besides, being able to accept ethnically different people ans assimilate them is a trademark of modern states-look at the US for example.

Your quote: "Do you want to make this a list of which idiot thinks what?" Do you even know who the authors are? And besides, its not what they think, its a fact. The Koundouriotes were of Albanian orgin. The leading defenders of Greek liberty around 1400-century were largely Non-Greek. Simon Sinas, the hugely wealthy son of Georgios Sinas, a Hellenized Vlach whose family came from Moschopolis in Southern Albania. The bottom line is, most modern Greeks have zero connection to ancient Greeks. A chinese person can also learn how to speak greek, eat greek food, and be Christian Orthodox. Your quote: "..Besides, being able to accept ethnically different people ans assimilate them is a trademark of modern states-look at the US for example." The difference between US and Greece is that the US does not practice forced assimilations or terrorize people to change their names. From the interview with Professor Victor Friedamn of University of Chicago: "...But the Greek policy was always trying to kill the language. It was especially horrible in the 1930s. Macedonian kids would go to school, and if they spoke their language, the language they learned at home, numerous ‘corrective’ methods were used: teachers beat them, or stuck their tongues with needles, or rubbed a hot pepper on their tongues; anything to make them stop speaking Macedonian. In the 1930s, people were put in jail just for speaking Macedonian. The Greek government had people skulking around the windows of people’s houses, listening to hear if they spoken Macedonian so that they could report them to the police. Mothers were thrown in jail for speaking Macedonian to their babies. They terrorized the Macedonians, and then, with the Greek Civil War, they drove many of them out. And then there’s the infamous ‘race clause’ in the amnesty law of 1982; it stipulated that to return the country and reclaim one’s property, all those who had been banished had to declare they were Greek by genos, by race or birth. Macedonians who were expelled, many just children at the time, in 1949, were never allowed to reclaim their property. It was racism, pure and simple." INTERVIEW RIGHT HERE: http://www.balkanalysis.com/2008/12/14/victor-friedman-on-macedonia-the-balkanalysiscom-interview/ .

"Do you even know who the authors are?" Does it matter? In science what matters is whether you can prove what you are saying, not who says what. I leave the decision of what one is to one's feelings. Of course you are really Bulgarian, but if you do not wish to be Bulgarian, fine. Many turks are really Serb, Bulgarian, Albanian, Greek and so one because of the practice of jennisarries, but if they feel turkish, fine. "most modern Greeks have zero connection to ancient Greeks" So what happened to ancient greeks? Why did they speak greek and develop a greek conscience? Or are you saying that you are related to ancient greeks? "The difference between US and Greece is that the US does not practice forced assimilations or terrorize people to change their names" Really? How many Pappas's are there in the US? Are you saying their original name was that? As to your famous professor, in those days people could go to jail for much less. And the choice of words shows his bias. Get it, there were no "Macedonians" as you use the term at the time. Memories from the struggle against Bulgarian comitadji were still fresh, as were raids by Bulgarian extremists. In short, there was a real threat to the country and people who had sided with the murderous comitadji and had refused the population exchnage were understandably under suspicion. All the measures you describe are relatively mild compared to the treatment of say Japanse-americans in the US during WWII. What is the problem with the 1982 clause? It simply said: Until that time the communist guerillas were considered traitors. That law allowed those who felt greek to return. Greece wanted the 28000 ABDUCTED children(according to the UN) returned then, not 40 years later, brainwashed by Tito and Stalin. These kids were as greek as anyone else , not phony Macedonian. You make it sound that all of the greek left was phony Macedonian! No one was expelled at the time; in fact the borders were closed, so no expulsion could take place. Many left wing people stayed and endured the hard years. The 1982 law allowed the guerillas who had fled into Yugoslavia after their defeat to return. I should add that if that law would be amended, then some of your compatriots could face war crime charges for their role as nazi collaborators.

So, if there were no greeks in byzantine times, how do you explain something like El Greco?(not El byzantino or El Albano or El Vlacho)

George, You of all people should know that todays Greeks (or people who wish to be Greek) have zero or any bloodline connection to ancient Greece. What you have is a melting pot of people. Your ancestor is most likely either Slavic, Albanian, Vlach or christian Turk. In late 1700 century, very few common people who lived in todays Greece, knew how to speak Attic Greek. It was mainly concentrated to the church for administrative puposes, or the to rich upper class. Here is what CM Woodhouse says about the "Greek nation": “...Greece included considerably fewer than half of those who regarded themselves as Greeks by virtue of their language,their religion, and (less plausibly) their race....It is a striking fact that the leading defenders of Greek liberty at this time (1400-century) were largely Non-Greek." Modern Greece A Short History C.M. Woodhouse Page 163 About C.M Woodhouse: C.M. Woodhouse was a Conservative politician and MP for Oxford from 1959 to 1966 and again from 1970 to 1974. Woodhouse was an expert on Greek affairs. He served most of his time in the War in Greece where his love for this country grew strong. After the conclusion of World War II, Woodhouse served as Second Secretary at the British Embassy in Athens, Greece until 1946, whereupon he returned to Britain. He is the author of 6 books on Greece.

it is very interesting how you present OPINION as fact. Woodhouse was part of a british saboteur team that operated in Greece during WWII with the help of partisans. He did not meet any of the 1821 revolution heroes. There was no such thing as a christian turk. Turks were the occupiers and religion was a defining factor. In fact it was the orthodox religion which tried to severe ties with pagan ancient history. And going to school to learn greek was not exactly something the ottomans were thrilled about or were going to allow. So after 400 years it is normal that people could not speak the language as their ancestors. Even today you have second generation greek-americans who can speak greek with difficulty. As Richard pointed out above, all the evidence we have is that people called themselves greek before the fall of the byzantine empire as well as afterwards. Given that religion and language, not to mention community standards were a significant barrier to mixing, this position seems untenable.

THE FORMER YUGOSLAV CITY OF SKOPIE (SCUPI, IN ANCIENT YEARS) HAS NEVER BEEN GEOGRAFICALLY IN MACEDONIA BUT IN DARDANIA. PLEASE SEE HISTORICAL MAPS AT THE HELLENISTIC AND AT THE ROMAN PERIOD TO REALIZE IT.THEREFORE,THE CITY OF SKOPIE DOES NOT BELONG IN MACEDONIA BUT IN DARDANIA(NOWDAYS KOSOVO).THANK YOU.

Normal that you lost your ancestors language??..Yet the "Slav Macedonians" against all odds managed to keep their language very much the same during the Ottoman expansion. One minor acception to note would be the dropping of noun cases. (NOTE: Uneducated racists: this does not make it a Bulgarian dialect).It's funny how many Macedonians in 'Aegean Macedonia' never forgot their language and they had your lousy government trying to eradicate it aswell as being occupied by the Turks. The Macedonians in Republic of Macedonia and Aegean Macedonia held onto their language as well as their pagan traditions regardless of the fact that the Turks were in charge...for 500 years they endured. So no, it is not normal to just completely lose your knowledge of a language - it can be preserved if all are willing. P.S. I have a friend that is 52 years old, both his parents were from Aegean Macedonia and they are Macedonian. He has lived in Australia his entire life and like many Macedonians from this area, the family is divided. Some of his cousins think that they are Greek and the others Macedonian. The ones that think they are Macedonian speak Macedonian as their grandparents also did. The ones that think they are Greek can say about 3 words, and are apparently in denial about the fact that Greek is not their grandparents' mother tongue. Have you got an explanation for this???